Play is how children explore, connect, and make sense of the world—but what if our definition of play is too narrow? In today's blog, Tara chats with speech-language pathologist and neurodiversity advocate Cari Ebert to discuss the power of recognizing autistic play as authentic play. They dive into the significance of deep interests in children's learning, the importance of meaningful connections, and how we can create environments that truly support autistic children. Cari shares practical strategies for parents and educators to foster engagement while presuming competence, ensuring that all children feel seen, valued, and celebrated for who they are.
Meet Cari Ebert, SLP
Tara: I am so thrilled to welcome you, Cari! Can you tell everyone a little bit about yourself?
Cari: I’m Cari Ebert, a speech-language pathologist and professional speaker from Kansas City, Missouri. My husband Jim and I have a 20-year-old autistic son who has profoundly shaped my understanding of neurodiversity-affirming practices. While my son is now an adult, my true passion is early childhood—I focus on supporting and researching the birth-to-five population because tiny humans are my jam!
Tara: I love how you share both professional and personal experiences as an SLP and parent. With decades of experience, we can reflect on how things have changed and think, ‘I wish I knew then what I know now.’ Our passion is paying it forward, helping the next generation learn from our journey.
Autistic Play As Authentic Play
Tara: Today, we’re diving into the beauty of autistic play as authentic play. You’re the perfect person to explain—how would you define it, and why is it important to recognize?
Cari: First, we need to understand that autism is a different way of thinking, not something to be fixed. Autistic children reach milestones, learn, communicate, move, and play differently. While traditional views of play often emphasize ‘appropriate' use of toys, neurodiversity-affirming approaches recognize that all play is valid. Whether an autistic child lines up objects, flaps, spins, or makes joyful noises, their play is authentic and should be honored as such.
Tara: That is a great explanation! Pamela Wolfberg, who developed Integrated Play Groups in the 90s, mentored me in the classroom, emphasizing that play should be joyful, intrinsically motivated, and fluid—ideas that align with your definition. Deep interests often take center stage in autistic play. How can parents and professionals celebrate and incorporate these passions into playtime?
Cari: A child’s play is individualized based on their interests and sensory preferences. Knowing a child’s deep interests helps build meaningful connections, which lead to meaningful communication. This cycle strengthens the bond between child and caregiver. For autistic children, their deep interests may differ from neurotypical children’s, so it’s essential to observe what brings them joy—whether it’s sensory activities or objects, not always store-bought toys. For example, I’ve worked with kids whose deep interests were vacuum cleaners and car washes, and these interests became powerful tools for communication and skill-building.
Deep Interests Are Powerful Tools For Connection
Cari: I worked with a family who had been told to discourage their child's obsession with car washes, but I encouraged them to embrace it. We watched YouTube videos about car washes during each visit, and the child made significant language progress. The family even bought a car wash pass and went every day, bonding with their child in a way they hadn't before. They stopped trying to suppress his deep interest and started building meaningful connections. This approach also worked with another child whose deep interest was smoke detectors, leading the family to form unique connections with local businesses. Deep interests are powerful tools for connection and communication, especially when we embrace them rather than suppress them.
Tara: That is a really great way to look at it. especially when you're looking at neurotypical kids having wide interests and then the deep interest for our autistic kids. It makes so much sense because it's kind of all-encompassing. I remember those days when people were like, we got to get rid of that. Don't talk about it. That's the advice people get.
Cari: It is, unfortunately. That's what we're trying to change.
Tara: When you really follow and embrace those deep interests, that's where some of the active engaged learning can happen, along with building an authentic positive relationship.
Creating Play Environments That Honor Autistic Play
Tara: What are some practical ways to create play environments that honor autistic play and support connection and growth? While certain toys may appeal to many autistic kids, how can we design spaces that foster these connections?
Cari: I love this quote, “When a flower doesn't bloom, you fix the environment, not the flower.” It applies to children too—when a child doesn't thrive, we need to fix the environment, not the child. We've spent decades trying to “fix” children, but now we understand the importance of environmental accommodation. I follow a three-step formula: Regulate, Reach, Teach.
First, regulate the child's nervous system, then build a meaningful connection, and finally, teach. You need to meet the child’s sensory needs first, like reducing noise and visual clutter. Flexible seating and creating calm spaces are key. For example, I never forced my son to sit as a toddler, he thrived while moving around.
Tara: You made me think of a student teacher named Scott who instinctively understood this. If a child was protesting during a table activity, he’d shift and get under the table with them, making the activity more comfortable. It was all about saving the relationship and avoiding power struggles. That flexibility stuck with me, and I knew he'd be great at what he did.
Child-Led Play
Cari: As a therapist, I encourage writing IEP goals that can be addressed during any activity, not just specific tasks. For example, instead of setting a goal that requires stringing beads, focus on fine motor skills or the pincer grasp in any activity. Research shows that when autistic children can choose the how and when of play, they're just as motivated to engage with adults. Child-led doesn’t mean a free-for-all; it means joining the child in their activity and embedding your strategies within it. Autistic children can sense when there’s an agenda, and if they do, they’ll disengage. Instead, follow their lead and incorporate your strategies into their deep interests.
Tara: I often tell teachers that when a student protests and refuses to engage, it’s not a reflection of the child but a sign to pivot. If a child isn’t interested, they’re not being defiant—they just don’t want to engage with the activity. In those moments, it’s important to let go of your plan, offer a choice, or switch to something the child enjoys, then incorporate therapy or learning into that activity.
Cari: You’re right—it’s an “us” problem when a child gets dysregulated, not a “them” problem. For decades, we’ve blamed the child, but now we need to look inward and assess what in our activity, approach, or environment is causing the child to disengage. It’s about understanding and adjusting our approach.
Autistic Play
Tara: Reflecting on Aaron's childhood, what did you learn about autistic play and how did it influence your approach as an SLP?
Cari: When my son Aaron was diagnosed in 2007, the focus was on “curing” autism, and there was concern about his lack of purposeful play. Therapists insisted he play with a Fisher Price Barn, even though he had no interest in farm animals. Looking back, I wish I had suggested he use the barn as a receptacle for things he cared about, like sorting bears or Mario characters. Aaron’s favorite activity was lining up Hot Wheels cars and bears in specific patterns, showing that the goal shouldn’t be to make autistic children play like neurotypical kids but to honor their neuro-type and play style while offering the necessary support.
Expanding Autistic Children's Play
Tara: I created “one-step” and “two-step” play options to support students, introducing visual cues to expand their play without forcing them. For example, if a student loves cars, I might model rolling a car down a ramp, using visuals to guide the activity. We had a student who shook cars, and instead of stopping her, we offered new options like the ramp. After modeling it once, her laughter showed she discovered something new. I encourage introducing simple ideas and letting kids choose what resonates with them without pressure.
Cari: It's about expanding, not changing, a child's play schemes. Autistic children often find comfort in repeating familiar play, which is calming and regulating. Our goal is to expand their play through pressure-free modeling, not demanding change. By being a safe, non-judgmental adult, we create a supportive environment that encourages development without pressure.
Tara: I didn’t mean to suggest you must play a certain way. The visuals are just a tool to help expand play schemes. And like throwing spaghetti on the wall, some ideas will stick and some won’t. It's important to honor what doesn’t stick.
Cari: Being mentally flexible as an adult is key since kids don’t have that skill yet. For example, when Aaron lined up cars, I didn’t stop him. Instead, I modeled expanding his play by using a book as a ramp for my own car. He was fascinated and began incorporating that into his play. This expanded his play scheme without force or coercion, focusing on child-centered, pressure-free growth.
Presume Competence in Autistic Play
Tara: What's the most unexpected or delightful thing an autistic child has taught you about play?
Cari: The most important thing I've learned is to presume competence. I worked with a little guy in Mississippi who had a deep interest in letters. His therapists had locked away all the letter toys, thinking he was obsessed, but when I gained his full access to the toys, he immediately went for his favorite ABC puzzle. I gave him space to play with no demands and silently supported him. He eventually said a letter, and I repeated it back, engaging in a back-and-forth. When he said “M” for “Mom,” he proudly ran to his mom, placed it on her lap, and smiled, showing his joy and accomplishment.
This experience emphasized the importance of presuming competence in autistic children. When we treat them as capable and honor their interests, as we did with this child and his love for letters, it leads to incredible breakthroughs. By giving him access to the toys he loved and supporting him without demands, we saw his potential unfold. Too often, children are underestimated and denied the opportunity to show what they can do because of preconceived notions about their abilities. This story is a powerful reminder that every child has unique strengths, and we must create environments that nurture those strengths.
Tara: It's the shift in how you approach things.
Neurodiversity-Affirming Approaches
Cari: Anyone can implement these practices, and I feel fortunate that they came naturally to me. I’ve been using neurodiversity-affirming approaches long before they were widely recognized. My son never went to behavior therapy because I believed in relationship-based learning. However, not everyone intuitively understands this approach. I want to ensure that early childhood educators and therapists are taught how to apply these practices, as it doesn’t come naturally for most and needs to be explicitly taught.
Tara: Absolutely, it needs to be explicitly taught. When I teach teachers or SLPs relationship-based strategies, I remind them that it takes pressure off by allowing them to focus on the relationship rather than always chasing outcomes. I tell them to explain to administration that relationship comes first.
Regulation, Connection, and Communication
Cari: You can write goals for positive connections between children and teachers, as well as for play, sensory, and regulation. In my “Learning to Learn” program, which I developed during the pandemic, I emphasize that foundational skills like regulation, connection, and communication should always come first before academics. These goals are crucial for autistic young children.
Tara: These align with Maslow's hierarchy of needs—regulation and connection are foundational. I love this!
Cari: Aaron has always had a deep interest in letters, carrying around a basket of foam letter pieces for years. His current passion involves labeling songs by Metallica and ACDC with a label maker, a gift he requested for Christmas. This is an example of how autistic adults retain childhood passions, often labeled “immature” by society. However, these interests are simply a part of the autistic neurotype, providing joy and comfort well into adulthood, just like nostalgia does for neurotypical adults.
Tara: Yeah, and it kind of makes me think that's his hobby. That's what he loves doing. Joy, that's the biggest piece.
Cari: Yep, that's his joy. So honor autistic joy. I think that I can give three last words honor autistic joy.
Listen to the Podcast: Episode 108
Cari's handout: https://cariebert.com/freebie
Autistic Play: Honoring Diverse Styles Of Play
If you use visual supports in your classroom or home, you are going to want to sign up for this free Visual Supports Starter Set ASAP! Click here to have one sent to your inbox. Also, be sure to read more about visual supports and how they can help autistic children here.
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