I’m excited to introduce you to my mentor, Dr. Pamela Wolfberg, a pioneer in the field of autism and play. We dive into what defines true play for all children and why it’s so important to ensure that our autistic kids have the opportunity to play in ways that bring them joy. Dr. Wolfberg shares her insights on creating inclusive play environments that honor each child’s individuality and help them connect with others through authentic play experiences.
Dr. Pamela Wolfberg: A Pioneer in Autism and Play Therapy
Tara: Welcome, Dr. Wolfberg! It’s such a joy to have you on the podcast. Can you tell us a little bit about yourself and your background in special education and autism?
Dr. Wolfberg: Thank you for inviting me, Tara! Well, my background in autism and play goes back quite a while. In fact, my interest in special education began because of my mother and my older sister, who was studying psychology at the time. My mom suggested I pursue something where I could immediately work after getting my degree, and special education was just beginning to expand in the 1970s. The laws were changing, allowing children with disabilities to be integrated into public schools.
Understanding Autism and Play: Insights from Dr. Wolfberg’s Classroom
Tara: That’s fascinating! But your first experience wasn't with autistic children, right?
Dr. Wolfberg: That's right. My first job was at a children's psychiatric hospital, working with kids who had been identified with what we might today call mental illness. Looking back, I’m sure some of those kids were on the autism spectrum, but at that time, we didn’t know much about autism. Unfortunately, the hospital employed some restrictive practices, like isolation rooms, which I didn’t feel aligned with my values. After a while, I felt that I needed to step away.
How Global Cultures Shaped Dr. Wolfberg’s Views on Autism and Play
Tara: That sounds tough. What did you do next?
Dr. Wolfberg: I was really disillusioned and needed a break. So, I ended up traveling the world! Little did I know that I was also learning about child development in a very organic way, especially by observing how children played across different cultures. It was amazing to see commonalities in play between children from places like the Philippines, China, and Africa.
Tara: Did this inspire your interest in play therapy?
Dr. Wolfberg: Absolutely! After traveling, I wanted to return to the U.S. and continue my education with a focus on play therapy. I trained in play therapy and worked with my first autistic child during that time. However, play therapy back then was very different—more interpretive and psychoanalytical. It wasn’t quite what it has evolved into today.
The Integrated Playgroups Model: Autism and Play Connections
Tara: How did you transition into working with autistic children in schools?
Dr. Wolfberg: I eventually moved to California, where I needed a master’s degree to teach, but because of a teacher shortage, I was able to work while completing my degree. I was offered two positions: one with a Spanish-speaking class and another in a classroom specifically for autistic children. It was one of only two such programs in California at the time, and from the moment I entered that classroom, I knew I had found my calling.
Tara: What did you observe that shaped your work with autistic children?
Dr. Wolfberg: While observing kids during recess, I noticed that while children with other disabilities were benefiting from being around neurotypical peers, the autistic children were often on the fringes. It wasn’t that they didn’t want to play—they were absolutely interested. But their subtle social cues or unique play styles weren’t recognized by their peers.
Tara: That sounds like a major turning point for you.
Dr. Wolfberg: It really was. I realized the missing piece was helping neurotypical children understand how autistic children play and communicate. That’s when I started thinking about how we could create opportunities for autistic children to socialize naturally with their peers. I wanted to adapt play therapy to emphasize peer interactions and really understand what autistic play looks like.
Tara: And this led to the creation of the Integrated Playgroups model, right?
Dr. Wolfberg: Yes! The Integrated Playgroups model grew from my desire to help autistic children connect with peers in ways that are meaningful for them. It focuses on facilitating inclusive play experiences with both autistic and neurotypical children, helping them build social relationships through play. It’s been incredibly rewarding to see how this model helps kids connect in authentic ways.
Redefining Autism and Play: Key Indicators of Meaningful Play
Tara: What is your definition of play?
Dr. Wolfberg: Play is typically defined through a developmental lens, but my recent work with Jashan Lewis Woods, an autistic doctoral student, has reimagined the definition to better suit autistic children. Play is enjoyable, but that doesn't always mean obvious laughter—it can be serious and still pleasurable for the child.
Tara: That’s a great point. So, what are the key indicators of play?
Dr. Wolfberg: Play has several quality indicators: it's pleasurable, voluntary, spontaneous, and intrinsically motivated. You can't force or train kids to play. It has to be meaningful to them, not just going through the motions.
Tara: And it's not about the outcome, right?
Dr. Wolfberg: Exactly. Play is process-oriented, not focused on an outcome. For example, kids might enjoy building a block tower just to knock it down—that’s part of the spontaneous joy. Adults sometimes interfere by imposing outcomes, which takes away from the play process.
Building Shared Play Cultures: Autism and Play for All Children
Tara: How does this apply specifically to autistic children?
Dr. Wolfberg: Two areas where we reimagined play for autistic kids are flexibility and literal thinking. While play is usually seen as flexible, autistic children may focus intensely on a special interest, what we call “monotropic” play. This focus allows them to enter a deep state of joy and engagement, which should be valued.
Another factor is the “non-literal” nature of play. Some autistic children enjoy imaginative play, but many prefer fact-based scenarios. As long as the key indicators—joy, spontaneity, intrinsic motivation—are present, their play, even if fact-based, should be respected.
Fostering Joy and Spontaneity in Autism and Play
Tara: Play is pleasurable and intrinsically motivated. The newer concept of monotropic play, where a child enters a “flow state” focused on their interest, also applies to play. Some educators still feel the need to stop certain behaviors to teach new ones, but I prefer gently introducing new play options. For example, we had a girl who loved banging toy cars together. Instead of stopping her, we modeled rolling the car down a ramp, and she loved it, laughing hysterically. It’s about offering new ways to explore, not forcing change.
Dr. Wolfberg: Yes, it’s not about throwing toys at kids and expecting them to thrive. Children often imitate others, but it takes time. As educators, we need to give them space to learn at their own pace. In the Integrated Playgroups model, we emphasize observation—watching, waiting, and learning from the children’s actions before intervening. It’s about immersing ourselves in their world first.
The Role of Educators and Parents in Supporting Autism and Play
Tara: In my membership, we discuss the OWL method: observe, wait, and listen. We must take the pressure off ourselves to jump in too quickly.
Dr. Wolfberg: Absolutely, observation is key. Parents and professionals both play an essential role in this. The Integrated Playgroups model focuses on bringing autistic and neurotypical children together to co-create their own play culture. Initially, we observed that autistic children would often try to initiate play, but neurotypical children didn’t pick up on these cues, leading to isolation. Our goal was to use visual supports, structured environments, and minimal adult intrusion to help foster meaningful interaction and play.
Scaffolding Autism and Play: Balancing Guidance and Freedom
Tara: It’s hard for educators, therapists, and parents to step back. We want to guide constantly. But in your manual, you emphasize being more like a stage director.
Dr. Wolfberg: Yes, we call it scaffolding. Initially, you're deeply involved, but gradually, you step back, becoming more like a coach. Letting the kids lead is key. We also focus on designing play spaces and guiding communication, encouraging children at their level of development.
Embracing Neurodiversity: Monotropic Autism and Play
Tara: You taught me to watch what the child loves and educate peers on that. It’s not about teaching the autistic child to play like neurotypical kids but building a shared play culture. I used this model for over a decade, and trust was crucial in helping the children connect.
Dr. Wolfberg: Absolutely. The Integrated Playgroups model isn't rigid; it’s creative and tailored to each child. We emphasize observation, using comprehensive assessments to see if kids are reaching their goals. It’s not about compliance but fostering social connections and shared play culture.
Tara: The double empathy problem comes to mind—we weren’t trying to make my student, Willy, play like neurotypical kids. It was about mutual understanding. I ran playgroups during recess, and that consistency built trust between the children.
Dr. Wolfberg: Those are the examples I’ve included in my field manual and trainings. Play culture evolves naturally, and every child brings their own expertise. It’s socially constructive, a blend of behavioral and developmental approaches that promotes shared expertise among kids.
Tara: You really emphasized listening to autistic kids and teaching neurotypical peers about their interests. It’s a two-way street.
Dr. Wolfberg: Exactly, and it’s important to recognize the harm some traditional approaches may have caused. Evidence-based practices often measure easy-to-track behaviors, but we need to focus on the quality and meaningfulness of the interactions from the child’s perspective.
The Value of Compassion Over Compliance in Autism and Play Therapy
Tara: Looking back, many of my students had different therapies, but at the core, they’re still who they were. Compassion and kindness always matter more than compliance.
Dr. Wolfberg: Yes, play is fundamental to development, and we need to give children the time and space for unstructured, free play. Too often, play becomes disguised as work.
Dr. Wolfberg’s Top Tips for Facilitating Autism and Play
Tara: If you had to give three tips to those working with autistic kids, what would they be?
Dr. Wolfberg: First, honor what children bring to play and foster joyful mutual engagement. Second, embrace neurodiversity and the unique ways each child expresses themselves. Third, find your own joy in working with the kids—let your style reflect who you are.
Tara: That’s so important! Playgroups create natural connections and mutual support.
Dr. Wolfberg: And research supports it—there are significant benefits for both autistic and neurotypical kids.
Tara: Thank you for everything you’ve done for me and the field.
Listen to the Podcast: Episode 90
Watch the interview:
Episode 88 – Gently Expanding Autistic Play: Tips for Parents and Educators
Episode 89 – Sensory Play: Autism Learning Through Hands-On Interaction
Integrated Play Groups Field Manual (updated version coming in 2025):
Learners On The Autism Spectrum
Reimagining Autistic Children’s Independent and Social Play with Peers Journal Article (2023)
Play & Imagination In Children With Autism
Uniquely Human Podcast (Barry Prizant)’s episode with Dr. Pamela Wolfberg
If you use visual supports in your classroom or home, you are going to want to sign up for this free Visual Supports Starter Set ASAP! Click here to have one sent to your inbox. Also, be sure to read more about visual supports and how they can help autistic children here.
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